August Abolins wrote to Sean Dennis <=-
That is a fine solution for programs that can still be
recompiled. But it appears that legacy 16/32bit programs that
are nolonger supported, will have a DOA in 2038, no?
That means that all the programs that people have so feverishly
archived and play with using retro computers or using modern
computers with 16/32bit VMs/OSes, will be rendered useless?
in the park. Who knows.. maybe some of us here will be just as
spry to keep BBSing in people's minds. And 17 years to 2038 is
a long way from 90! I'd start worrying at 2050. :D
That means that all the programs that people have so
feverishly archived and play with using retro computers or
using modern computers with 16/32bit VMs/OSes, will be
rendered useless?
Yes.
.. I may buy a small travel trailer or motorhome and live
in it full-time traveling around the US. If that happened,
I would shut down my BBS and turn over Micronet fully to
Andrew. I'd still participate via offline mail though.
Hey.. I just heard that William Shatner turned 90yrs. That's>about 30yrs more than me. He does NOT look 90! I know people
August Abolins wrote to Sean Dennis <=-
And.. a place like Danger Bay BBS (which seems to have the most awesome/largest collection of doors) will have issues with many
of those games failing?
As you many know, several Fidonet echos are linked-up with
Telegram. Perhaps this echo could join the roster. :D Think
of it - convenient and synchronized across devices. :)
Micronet will stay in Micronet. I have access to my mail across three computers. My phone is a phone; nothing else.
Micronet is not to be gated anywhere at any time (I am not
talking about using NNTP to access Micronet; I mean porting
Micronet outside of FTN/QWK).
If I wanted Micronet to be a chat group online, I'd go set
up BBoard on a website. This is also the same thing with
my Fidonet echoes.
The -sole- gate I will allow is one I am creating to test
out gating CHWARE in Fidonet and MIN_BBS in here using
Blackhole but it's just a test.
How is NNTP not-gating? It is very much outside ftn/qwk. FTN-
to-NNTP requires very much quite a bit of porting and fudging to
make it recognizeable and useable with ng readers. FTN-to-
Telegram is not much different. ;) Instead of an ng reader,
the Telegram app makes things nice and pretty.
How is NNTP not-gating?
Echomail is a term long associated with FTN. It is a just an
echochat by another name. ;)
Sounds interesting. I don't know what this Blackhole thing is.
See the Discord vs everythign else thread in FSXnet for the reasoning.
I remember building a Mumble server and a set of bots for playing some
RPG games over VOIP, using my own infrastructure, and some Discord
user convinced everybody to use Discrod instead for the game, citing
all the capabilities Discord has, and all the bots available and its healthy ecosystem. They forced the issue and we ended up playing over Discord because it was obvious it was "so much featureful". It turned
out we ended up using NONE of the advertised extra capatilities. So in
the end we ended up using an untrustworthy platform controlled by a
third party in exchange of (supposed) perks we didn't use.
Hello Arelor,
Friday March 26 2021 04:21, you wrote to August Abolins:
See the Discord vs everythign else thread in FSXnet for the reasoning.
I use Discord a lot and to me, it seems like a more mature version of Conference Room which was a very "GUI-fied" version of IRC. In fact, IIRC, Discord developers said something along that lines (of Discord being based o IRC).
To me, I will always love the original. :)
Later,
Sean
Hello Arelor,
Friday March 26 2021 20:16, you wrote to me:
I remember building a Mumble server and a set of bots for playing some RPG games over VOIP, using my own infrastructure, and some Discord
user convinced everybody to use Discrod instead for the game, citing
all the capabilities Discord has, and all the bots available and its healthy ecosystem. They forced the issue and we ended up playing over Discord because it was obvious it was "so much featureful". It turned out we ended up using NONE of the advertised extra capatilities. So in the end we ended up using an untrustworthy platform controlled by a third party in exchange of (supposed) perks we didn't use.
I have heard that same story a lot from several "pro gamers" (hah) I know of moving from a trusted platform to Discord that records everything you write, including PMs, for the government to regularly peruse through whether it needs to or not.
Later,
Sean
Ugh, I hate Discord myself too. I usually try to encourage people to
use XMPP, since it's federated, can be made mostly private, and most clients support end-to-end encryption. But my daughter uses Discord
anyway much to my chagrin. Thankfully I've gotten almost all of my immediate family using XMPP, so a small success!
Now if I can only get them using the BBS too...
Mariposa wrote to Sean Dennis <=-
Ugh, I hate Discord myself too. I usually try to encourage people to
use XMPP, since it's federated, can be made mostly private, and most clients support end-to-end encryption. But my daughter uses Discord
anyway much to my chagrin. Thankfully I've gotten almost all of my immediate family using XMPP, so a small success!
Hello Arelor,
Friday March 26 2021 20:16, you wrote to me:
I remember building a Mumble server and a set of bots for playing some RPG games over VOIP, using my own infrastructure, and some Discord
user convinced everybody to use Discrod instead for the game, citing
all the capabilities Discord has, and all the bots available and its healthy ecosystem. They forced the issue and we ended up playing over Discord because it was obvious it was "so much featureful". It turned out we ended up using NONE of the advertised extra capatilities. So in the end we ended up using an untrustworthy platform controlled by a third party in exchange of (supposed) perks we didn't use.
I have heard that same story a lot from several "pro gamers" (hah) I know of moving from a trusted platform to Discord that records everything you write, including PMs, for the government to regularly peruse through whether it nee to or not.
Later,
Sean
Ugh, I hate Discord myself too. I usually try to encourage people to use XMP since it's federated, can be made mostly private, and most clients support end-to-end encryption. But my daughter uses Discord anyway much to my chagri Thankfully I've gotten almost all of my immediate family using XMPP, so a sm success!
Now if I can only get them using the BBS too...
Mariposa wrote to Sean Dennis <=-
Ugh, I hate Discord myself too. I usually try to encourage people to use XMPP, since it's federated, can be made mostly private, and most clients support end-to-end encryption. But my daughter uses Discord anyway much to my chagrin. Thankfully I've gotten almost all of my immediate family using XMPP, so a small success!
I'll have to look into XMPP... I don't use Discord (don't HATE it, just don't prefer it) - been using SLACK for my PBEM games and it works
GREAT! Cross platform, apps for phone, tablet, computer, etc.
... File not found: Loading something that looks similar...
Ugh, I hate Discord myself too. I usually try to encourage people to use XMP since it's federated, can be made mostly private, and most clients support end-to-end encryption. But my daughter uses Discord anyway much to my chagri Thankfully I've gotten almost all of my immediate family using XMPP, so a sm success!
Now if I can only get them using the BBS too...
Groups of friends and relatives usually have less of a need for running forum or forum-like software, and that is mostly what BBS are nowadays: telnet or
SSH forums with doors thrown in.
I used to be flexible and opt into the platforms my friends use, because the alternative was to be left stranded out of a social group. I discovered that, by doing so, I ended up suffering the penalties of running crappy spywarey software, but I didn't get meaningful social or business results. So I opted out. I may use this filthy tech for specific reasons but I am certainly not loading them in any of my main devices anymore.
I used to be flexible and opt into the platforms my friends use, because alternative was to be left stranded out of a social group. I discovered that, by doing so, I ended up suffering the penalties of running crappy spywarey software, but I didn't get meaningful social or business results So I opted out. I may use this filthy tech for specific reasons but I am certainly not loading them in any of my main devices anymore.
Same here. I do my best to avoid any privacy disrespecting service or closed source software. While I have to be a bit flexible with regard to phones for now, I'm still hopeful for practical Linux phone in the future. The PinePhon is almost there, but still rough around the edges.
-- Allie/Mariposa
Regarding the phones, I think it is not a problem of having a privacy conscious smartphone. You can get an old Galaxy and shoehorn Replicant into it if you want to.
The problem is that once you get a phone which runs a trustworthy private system, society expects you to load a banking program loaded with spyware, or some datamining messaging application.
What this means is either you load this funky programs into your phone, ruining it, or you don't - and this is often not an option. I mean, a banking smartphone application is actually mandatory for some banking services. You are supposed to have it.
XMPP is nice. You can also strap end-to-end encryption over it, which is a great bonus when compared to some of the alternatives.
The drawback is that interoperativity is not consistent across devices. Basic functions (ie messaging) work the same for all devices, but weird protocol extensions may not be available to all your contacts.
What this means is either you load this funky programs into your phone, ruining it, or you don't - and this is often not an option. I mean, a banking smartphone application is actually mandatory for some banking services. You are supposed to have it.
True, although if the operating system on the phone allows you to properly sandbox applications and isolate them from the rest of the system, you could probably better handle untrusted applications more securely. Right now while there are some fine-grained permissions, they tend to apply globally, and so apps refuse to run if you haven't granted them the ability to read all your text messages, determine your location, etc.
I really think it's more about putting the consumer/user in control of their own devices, rather than just being beholden to a corporation who makes the decisions for you.
-- Allie/Mariposa
And.. a place like Danger Bay BBS (which seems to have the most awesome/largest collection of doors) will have issues with many
of those games failing?
Yes. Actually, the 16-bit doors are going to fail much sooner.
How is NNTP not-gating?
Because the mail is not being gated to another network or being posted publicly on the Internet via an uncontrolled method. When a BBS runs a NNTP gate for echomail, it's simply a network topology conversion.
Echomail is a term long associated with FTN. It is a just an
echochat by another name. ;)
Echomail is also not officially part of Fidonet. It's considered such
now but P4 covers netmail which was what Fidonet was originally designed for. Echomail was a kludge slapped onto Fidonet years later.
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